Risk Is a Growth Function

0:00 Today is a first for this show to guest, both of whom are CRO and they work at the same company.

0:07 Give me to the last decision where the two of you genuinely did not agree.

0:12 What was the call and how did it actually get settled?

0:15 Tyler, our chief revenue officer, was actually the first one to say hold on is, you know,

0:22 this is the right environment for us to be actually making that change.

0:26 It feels like that spray and pray email blast motions haven't been as effective.

0:34 And I think that leads to inbounds, not even outbounds based upon,

0:37 hey, I saw what you're doing over there. I love that. I've never seen that before.

0:40 Mostly your AI strategy is more of a data model problem.

0:44 An answer to a question can never be that's what the agent told us, right?

0:48 We have to be able to show our work, our new partnership with Kroger and went live with that

0:53 program. Kroger is the largest standalone grocery store in the United States.

0:57 Seeing risk and revenue together on the same team.

1:01 I think it's a model for how companies should be approaching this.

1:06 I would love to hear what is next for imprint.

1:16 So you two have the same three letter title and you sit on the same P&L.

1:21 Take me to the last decision where the two of you genuinely did not agree.

1:27 What was the call and how did it actually get settled?

1:31 Yeah, this is a fun one and I think it's going to be a surprising one too.

1:39 Actually, the last thing that I can recall is just from a couple of weeks ago.

1:45 And I was advocating for a policy expansion. We've invested a lot in alternative data sources

1:54 to be able to enhance our fraud detection and mitigation capabilities.

1:59 And the idea was to be able to reduce the customers that we are sending through

2:06 what we call an IDB intervention.

2:08 Now, even though our IDB process is quite frictionless and easy to do,

2:14 we take adding any friction into our flow very, very seriously.

2:20 And there's a very high bar.

2:21 So where we can reduce that, we're excited to do that.

2:25 And it certainly helps with conversion.

2:27 So I was advocating for this change to our policy

2:31 to actually expand approval rates and reduce the surface area of IDVs.

2:37 And Tyler, our chief revenue officer, was actually the first one to say,

2:45 hold on, is this the right environment for us to be actually making that change,

2:51 given the fact that AI tooling available to fraudsters has also rapidly increased innovation

3:00 in terms of the type of fraud that we are seeing.

3:03 So it was very interesting.

3:05 Of course, I walked him through the rationale here

3:10 and how we were enabling it safely in a very data-driven manner

3:15 and felt confident with that decision.

3:17 But just that example should give you a sense of the dynamic here.

3:22 We're both really optimizing for growth,

3:27 but growth that is durable and resilient and would last us through the economic cycle.

3:35 Tyler, what kept you both aligned where you have the chief risk officer saying,

3:41 hey, let's accelerate.

3:42 And you're actually in the seat trying to hold back.

3:45 What mechanism is keeping you both together?

3:48 I think it's less about holding back.

3:49 And it's more about ensuring that the growth that we're driving is durable and resilient.

3:55 That's what Lillieth and I are both focused on.

3:58 It's what the whole leadership team here is focused on.

4:00 But the other side of that in my job is working with our partners directly.

4:04 And these are brands with 100-year legacies, more than 100-year legacies.

4:08 They're not optimizing for a number on a slide tomorrow.

4:12 They're optimizing for long-term, durable relationships with their customers.

4:17 And that's what we need to enable.

4:19 And so making sure that we are supporting them,

4:24 we're helping them build those relationships without causing blowback, right?

4:28 So us overextending a customer and they getting into trouble on their credit card,

4:33 not only is it terrible for the customer,

4:34 it's the brands don't want to see that either, right?

4:36 We want to make sure that we are setting these customers up for success

4:41 because it's not just their personal success,

4:43 which is incredibly important in terms of financial empowerment,

4:46 but also success of the brand for which they have a deep relationship

4:50 and we're trying to support that relationship.

4:53 And so there is absolutely a trade-off between

4:55 short-term quick dopamine hits of growth

4:59 and then building for the long-term, durable, resilient kind of platform

5:04 and user base that we need to see with our partners and our members.

5:09 So when you both sit down in executive meeting,

5:11 you're going to a board meeting together,

5:13 do you have a shared target, shared goal that makes this decision-making easier?

5:19 Because I've seen it where one executive has a goal to accomplish something,

5:23 so they're going to do everything they can to hit their number.

5:25 Another one has something else,

5:27 but they're competing against each other.

5:29 What type of goal system do you all have set up to keep you aligned?

5:34 I can get us started here, Tyler, jump in.

5:36 We definitely have our individual metrics that we are looking at.

5:40 You know, I'm looking at things like approval rates,

5:43 I'm looking at offer acceptance rates,

5:47 and Tyler is, of course, focused on how many accounts are we adding.

5:51 But ultimately, we are both also accountable

5:55 for making sure that we are balancing that risk and reward trade-off

6:01 in an optimal manner and maximizing for profitability as well.

6:06 So I think that is, you know, an area where, you know,

6:09 it's very clear to us that that's ultimately the objective.

6:13 Risk at imprint is really not a traditional control function.

6:19 I am not incentivized to minimize losses.

6:24 Really, my role is to drive growth, to find ways to say yes,

6:29 but say that safely while staying within our risk appetite.

6:35 Yeah, I think I'd say there's a big difference

6:38 between what do we measure within our given teams

6:40 and where we have the most control and what are we accountable for, right?

6:44 And so we're measuring the things that are leading indicators

6:46 of that durable growth that we talked about.

6:48 But ultimately, we're both accountable for company profitability

6:52 and helping our partners grow these brands

6:55 and the relationships with their customers.

6:56 That's what we're accountable for.

6:59 And it actually makes it really easy at the end of the day

7:02 when that's the North Star.

7:04 And that's what not just the two of us,

7:06 but the whole company culture is focused on, is supporting that outcome.

7:11 There's actually very few disagreements about the direction that we should go.

7:15 Sometimes it's about the pace.

7:16 Sometimes it's about the scale of a test, things like that.

7:18 How quickly can we get the learnings

7:20 because we're all really excited about something.

7:23 But in terms of the direction and the decision-making, it's really helpful.

7:28 A tiebreaker is not needed when we're working off the same target.

7:35 I worked with a CRO, his name's Tom Miller,

7:38 and he ran companies like Zscaler.

7:40 Him and I worked together at E-mailage,

7:41 and he's worked at a number of excellent cybersecurity companies.

7:45 And he used to say the most important component of a race car

7:49 to make sure it can go fast is brakes.

7:52 And if you don't have those brakes,

7:55 then you're putting the entire race at risk.

7:58 Lalitha, how do you see risk as part of the overall go-to-market strategy

8:04 and growth strategy that you're working on with Tyler?

8:06 Definitely.

8:06 I think we work so closely throughout the life cycle of a deal, if you will.

8:13 And there's really no clean handoffs, as such, across our teams.

8:19 And it's very deliberate.

8:21 So right from the beginning of a deal, we are so in sync about if we can get data

8:28 from our partners that enables us to understand their customer base better,

8:36 we're able to just underwrite in a much more effective manner.

8:39 So to make this real with a partner like Rakuten,

8:43 we're able to get information around how long has a customer been a member with Rakuten?

8:50 How have they been transacting over time?

8:53 What has been that trajectory in terms of spend and engagement?

8:57 And that gives us such great signal from a risk perspective.

9:02 So even if somebody looks like their credit score might not be perfect

9:07 or they might have a blemish on their credit history,

9:10 that additional information to us is a deep signal of high intent and loyalty

9:17 that gives us orthogonal information that's just not available to other issuers

9:23 through the credit bureau alone.

9:25 So we leverage that to be able to expand approval rates, to be able to say yes more,

9:31 expand access to credit, right size the credit lines and the exposure we are taking

9:38 to really be tailored to the usage patterns of that customer,

9:44 their unique spend and reward redemption history as well.

9:48 And that just allows us again to deepen the engagement

9:52 and drive more engagement for our brand partners and more monetization as well.

9:58 So just to make this real, with booking.com a card holder,

10:03 an imprint card holder with booking.com books three to four times as many trips

10:09 as another member that doesn't have a card.

10:13 So we do see this actually drive that incremental spend and engagement in a very tangible way.

10:21 I think unlocking that growth but keeping it safe,

10:25 having your proprietary data that can enable that I think is a huge strategic advantage.

10:32 You all are running up on a $1.2 billion valuation recently.

10:37 Tyler, what has been the go-to-market strategy to get imprint to where it is today?

10:45 And what go-to-market motions are working really well?

10:50 Yeah, I think first off, it's finding brands that really want to build those

10:54 relationships with their customers.

10:56 From my team, when we're working with partners day in and day out,

10:59 whether they've already become a partner and launched a program

11:02 or were in early days of the conversation,

11:06 it's understanding that the important number isn't how many card holders do you have.

11:11 It's like, what is the behavior that you want to see?

11:12 What are the business metrics that you want to move?

11:15 And how can we build a card program around those strategic goals and priorities?

11:20 If I never talked to a partner leadership team about the number of card holders,

11:26 the number of transactions, great, because it means that we can talk about

11:29 how we're driving the business and things that actually matter for their business,

11:33 whether it be visits or trips or booking different types of trips

11:39 or total share of wallet at their store.

11:42 And so that's really what it is about, is understanding what matters most to them

11:46 and figuring out who in the organization can get us that insight

11:52 in a way that isn't this quarters or strategy. And it's always a little bit hard to manage

11:57 as leadership has changed at our partners, but focusing on those goals

12:03 and then building not just our reporting around, it's not just what we talk about,

12:08 but it's designing the value prop of the card program,

12:11 how we engage with those customers, where we go find them, right?

12:16 Because it's a balance, we want to impact those metrics.

12:21 But if we say, we're driving 10X the outcome, but it's only across 12 card holders,

12:27 well, that doesn't matter for their business.

12:29 We need to manage both the scale and the behavior and business outcomes together

12:34 to make sure that we're capturing the share of checkout, the outcomes that they want,

12:39 in a way that is actually meaningful for their business and not just a side quest.

12:44 When you're in a strategic deal, I mean, I'm seeing logos like booking.com,

12:49 Rakuten, these are huge enterprise accounts.

12:52 Lalitha, do you ever get involved in the sales process or sales strategy

12:57 in order to close these deals?

12:59 Such a good question. And actually I do, right?

13:02 Because so much of what we, our mode is to be able to really use this data.

13:12 We sit so uniquely at the intersection of both the customer and the merchant,

13:17 which gives us this ability to use this additional information from our partners

13:23 to really drive much more access to credit,

13:26 to really right size those credit lines, to drive more spend and engagement.

13:31 So I definitely do join in on those conversations.

13:37 Our partners also want to make sure that the experience that we are offering

13:42 to their cardholders is very, very secure, that we have the state of the art security

13:50 infrastructure in place as well, so that we can keep their cardholder information

13:56 very secure and safe and make sure that the accounts is also very secure.

14:02 So they definitely want to hear from me.

14:04 I think the other thing that we are also uniquely positioned to do is we are a small risk team,

14:15 but we are very nimble in our approach as well.

14:18 So what we do is we're able to iterate very quickly.

14:21 So if we see a cardholder is actually paying us on time,

14:26 showing positive behaviors like linking their bank accounts so we can auto debit their payments,

14:32 we'll actually give them a credit line increase fairly quickly.

14:36 Even two payments in, we'll give you a credit line increase.

14:41 We won't wait for a year or 18 months for the data to bake.

14:45 So we do talk to them about all these capabilities we have

14:49 that really enable us to, again, drive more of that spend and engagement.

14:55 The other thing that I love that's very much a part of our playbook is

15:00 we also want to drive incrementality for our partners.

15:04 So we want to bring in new customers that actually are not currently in their loyalty database already.

15:15 And we are actually able to do this quite successfully as well.

15:20 We're really investing in creating response modeling and targeting modeling

15:27 that allows us to understand who should we be targeting that may be in the vicinity

15:32 of a Crate and Barrel store or an HEB store that doesn't have a card

15:38 that's potentially not a shopper today at HEB,

15:41 but they see this really compelling credit card offer and that brings them into the store.

15:48 So I think that's very much a part of our strategy as well.

15:51 And we're really investing in terms of being able to drive that incrementality

15:57 and new audiences that use the credit card as a gateway in terms of interacting with the brand.

16:07 This seems like a really big competitive advantage.

16:11 Maybe I'll ask a silly question.

16:12 I'm assuming most of the growth is a sales-led motion to get into companies

16:19 like Booking and Rakuten and Crate and Barrel.

16:22 Are you landing mainly through partner channels or sales-led initiatives?

16:27 Or is there a product-led motion going here as well?

16:31 In terms of landing new brands and partnerships, that'd be a sales-led.

16:34 But in terms of within that partnership driving customer growth and member growth

16:40 for our card program, that's a marketing we're driving through marketing,

16:44 both our own marketing and through our partner channels.

16:47 So working with partners on their experiences and their ecosystem

16:51 to make sure that we're surfacing the card, the application,

16:55 whether it's at checkout or onboarding, it depends on their experience.

16:59 But doing it in the right moments where it's contextual and personalized and relevant

17:03 for that customer so that we can get them into the application and serve them,

17:09 they can get more value from that brand.

17:11 So it depends on which partner you're talking about.

17:14 Makes a ton of sense.

17:16 I'm curious, I feel like sitting here, September 30th,

17:21 2026, so much has changed in GoToMarket, especially in the last couple of years.

17:27 What are some motions that seem to be working to get in front of the brands?

17:32 It feels like that spray and pray, email blast motions haven't been as effective.

17:39 What are you doing today in 2026 to get in front of new logos?

17:44 In terms of getting in front of new logos, I think we have, to date,

17:47 really focused on word of mouth, right?

17:51 So it's not a huge industry.

17:54 We also don't have thousands of partners either, right?

17:57 So there's an opportunity for us to focus on the partners we do have

18:02 and turn them into promoters.

18:04 We do some outreach to brands or enterprise logos that we think would be ripe

18:10 or they have an existing program and we want to win that deal.

18:15 Oftentimes, there's a conversation with an existing partner or someone we've worked

18:20 with already as a way to help us get a foot in the door.

18:23 That has been really effective for us in the past as we've gotten to this scale.

18:28 But we're still exploring new ways to continue to add more and more logos every year.

18:34 We'll never be in a place, I think, for a traditional unsecured credit card program

18:40 where we're adding 500 logos a year.

18:43 I think that's not the business that we're in.

18:46 But we've been doing three to five per year and we're going to target moving that.

18:52 Can we get to five or 10 logos a year in the next 18 to 24 months?

18:59 That's the target.

19:00 And so reaching directly out to those brands, we've built a reputation.

19:03 We've built the foundation and trying to start those relationships early and proactively.

19:10 I'll just add to that.

19:11 I think a couple of other things that, like Tyler said, it's that word of mouth that is

19:16 so strong for us is also driven by the fact that we've actually invested

19:20 in building our own vertically integrated tech stack.

19:24 So we don't rely on external processors like T-SYS and Piserv.

19:31 And that's actually a huge advantage for us because it just allows us

19:35 to meet the partners where they're at in a very unique way.

19:40 So an example of this is at HEB, we're able to do Q-level rewards.

19:46 And we were able to really bring in that level of differentiation and granularity

19:52 to our product offering, which I think is very unique and bodes very well for us.

19:58 And I think that leads to inbounds, not even outbounds, right?

20:01 So we get brands reaching out to us based upon, hey, I saw what you're doing over there.

20:05 I love that.

20:05 I've never seen that before in a value prop.

20:08 And how can I get that for my customers?

20:11 That's been, it's very much a privilege and an amazing place for us to be.

20:16 And it's exciting for us.

20:18 And so that's why, that's how we've kind of gotten to where we are today

20:22 is by starting with some of those more dynamic and flexible integrations

20:26 that are only possible because we have our own tech stack.

20:30 I think the winning formula of build a great product,

20:34 take care of your customers always seems to help companies grow

20:37 and get them to where they want to be.

20:39 I'm curious, this proprietary tech stack,

20:43 as well as the proprietary data you have to do your own risk assessments,

20:46 feels like a really strong strategic advantage.

20:49 Lalitha, are you involved quite a bit on enablement of the teams

20:52 that are driving expansion of your existing customers

20:55 and getting in front of the existing customers

20:57 for how they can continue to unlock growth?

21:00 Definitely.

21:00 I think this is something, again, that we're very much a lock step here.

21:05 Like the thing we want to do is, in terms of where we are very uniquely positioned

21:14 to serve our partners, we are a complete data insights

21:21 and intelligence platform, but also a holistic payments platform.

21:26 And we're investing in building out newer payment methods

21:30 for our partners, launching newer products

21:32 so we can really tailor our product offering

21:36 to be very customized to the individual customer.

21:40 I think if you think about where we are headed in this era

21:43 of agentic commerce as well, it's increasingly becoming so important

21:50 to be able to deepen engagement, but do that through the lens of personalization.

21:57 And that's really where we're investing.

21:59 So we are looking to invest in building a holistic understanding

22:07 of each and every customer from the lens of, of course,

22:10 the traditional credit bureau data, but also taking into account

22:14 the partner data we've spoken about, but also very importantly,

22:18 taking into account all the interactions the customer has had

22:22 with our customer service team, all the interactions

22:27 the customer has had in app with us and taking all that context

22:31 at any given time to really determine what is that next best action

22:37 for the customer that's going to deepen engagement,

22:41 bring in more lifetime value and really expand monetization.

22:45 You know, an example that I love to share is that we have a customer

22:50 that's, you know, in the checkout flow, booking an airline ticket

22:54 at booking.com, and this is going to tip them above their credit limit.

22:59 How do we build an experience where we give them a credit limit on the spot

23:04 that allows them to not only book their airline ticket,

23:07 but also their hotel and car rental with us.

23:12 So, you know, that those are the kind of experiences

23:16 that we are looking to develop that are just so deeply personalized.

23:21 One of the things I'd love to, if I can, like that I think has been coming through

23:24 that maybe is a little different about Imprint,

23:27 is a lot of other folks out there, a lot of companies out there

23:32 will have, you know, the sales team and the revenue team,

23:34 then hands off to legal or hands off to risk to solve problems.

23:39 We argue, like Lillitha and I in particular, but Imprint in general,

23:43 we don't do handoffs, right?

23:46 We, you know, my team lands a brand, a logo,

23:50 my team drives, go to market for that,

23:52 then I don't hand off, okay, now that it's live,

23:56 how do we grow this program, right?

23:58 That's not someone else's job, that's also my team's job, right?

24:01 And how do we get the right data from the partner

24:04 to drive approval rates and drive this flywheel for personalization?

24:08 Lillitha's team is focused on that from day one of the partnership

24:12 and we continue to iterate on that over time

24:14 because the partner evolves, their customers change.

24:17 We bring on new capabilities, new alternative data sources.

24:21 We're constantly kind of building on those

24:23 and so it's that partner obsession that is true across my team, Lillitha's team,

24:28 but really the whole company that means by having that continuity across,

24:32 we don't have any handoffs, right?

24:33 There's no, oh, I didn't know that, I didn't have that context before,

24:36 so like, you know, that's not what the partner wanted,

24:39 so we'll have to backtrack and fix that or that's not possible.

24:43 We can tell them, we know what we can deliver,

24:45 we know what matters to them and we can very quickly on day one,

24:49 start delivering what we need to on those business outcomes we talked about earlier

24:55 and then continue to build on that foundation

24:58 over the duration of the partnership, right?

25:00 These are long-term partnerships, they're not one-year deals,

25:02 they're typically seven or longer, seven years or longer

25:05 and so we're trying to build significantly

25:09 both in terms of capability and scale and outcomes over that duration

25:14 and you can't do that by handing off to someone

25:16 who like is picking up and starting without context, right?

25:20 Super important to us.

25:22 Yeah, and I think you're ahead of the curve on this,

25:25 but I would say a lot of other CROs are following a similar trend.

25:30 We went from having a hyper-fractionalized go-to-market team

25:34 where you have the BDR, SDR, closing AE, onboarding specialist,

25:40 then you have the CSM, then you have the existing,

25:42 you have six to ten people involved in a deal,

25:46 all with the relationship decaying along the way.

25:49 And nobody really owning the entire outcome,

25:52 and especially if you're in this type of business

25:55 where there are large, long-term strategic partnerships

25:58 with the brand, with the partners that you're working

26:00 to get to the brands through.

26:02 I think that full-stack revenue ownership is very important.

26:07 Totally agree, and I think it's really,

26:10 the way I talk to my team about it is I don't ever want to hear,

26:13 the partnership never hear that,

26:14 "Oh, that team dropped the ball, let me go find them,"

26:17 because that team is imprint, right?

26:19 We're all imprint, they should care that it's imprint,

26:22 and if we drop the ball, we should own it,

26:23 we just shouldn't drop the ball, right?

26:26 And so making sure that we are operating as one team

26:30 and presenting to both the partner,

26:32 but also the member, right?

26:34 As one team, and especially when you're member-facing,

26:37 one team includes the enterprise brand

26:39 that we're working closely with.

26:40 We are representing their brand,

26:43 and we have to make sure that we are not just their brand,

26:45 but their culture and their way of doing customer support,

26:49 their way of communicating.

26:51 All of that has to come through

26:52 in every interaction that we have,

26:54 both with the employees at our partners,

26:56 but also with their customers and our members.

27:01 And again, I think that's the right trend,

27:03 kind of wearing the same banner as a company.

27:08 One area I'd like to get into

27:10 is how imprint is implementing AI,

27:16 either on the product side, the risk management,

27:19 risk mitigation side, but also the revenue side,

27:22 and how you're using in your marketing materials,

27:26 and also how you're using AI

27:28 to help take care of your customers.

27:31 Maybe, Lalitha, we could start with you.

27:32 Yeah, definitely.

27:34 I think this is a topic that's near and dear to my heart.

27:38 It's just been such a journey over the last few quarters,

27:43 and I will say, honestly, the day in the life

27:46 of somebody on the risk team today at Imprint

27:48 is entirely different from what it was

27:51 even three or four months ago.

27:54 One thing I'll call out is,

27:55 and I know Tyler will dig into

27:57 how the marketing and the growth teams are using AI,

28:00 but really, at the crux of it

28:02 is the fact that our CTO and tech teams

28:06 really enabled us to do this

28:07 by investing in a centralized platform, if you will,

28:12 that really standardized data access,

28:15 made sure that we had the right scaffolding

28:18 and guardrails in place that unlocked teams

28:21 to build specialized use cases around it.

28:24 So I think I can't underscore enough

28:27 that all this wouldn't have been possible

28:29 without those centralized investments

28:31 that the tech team made,

28:33 and made it really easy for folks

28:35 to get access to the tools,

28:37 but also made sure that it was safe access,

28:40 that it was the right permissioning in place,

28:43 that we had the right rigor

28:45 around how changes are deployed,

28:49 and the right observability through and through

28:52 in terms of, if you have an AI workflow,

28:55 really understanding what are the data sources behind it,

28:58 what is the logic behind it,

29:00 how reproducible it is,

29:02 and how certain you are in terms of the outcomes from it

29:06 was very, very key.

29:09 But aside from that,

29:10 I think, excited to share that it has been

29:13 such an enabler for us on the risk team side.

29:18 A lot of time was spent on very manual,

29:20 sort of more tedious work,

29:22 but very important work,

29:23 like making sure you're gathering data

29:25 from many different sources,

29:27 creating weekly reporting.

29:29 This was actually the first thing

29:30 that we invested in automating,

29:32 and it was a pain point for the team,

29:34 because the team had to do this every week,

29:37 and it was such a big unlock,

29:39 and just helped folks start to get their rhythm

29:42 around adopting AI in different ways.

29:46 But aside from that,

29:48 there's a lot of other work around things

29:50 like making sure we're investing

29:52 in the right governance documentation

29:54 when we deploy new models

29:57 and policies as well

29:59 that we could actually automate using AI,

30:02 and that freed up time for the team

30:05 to spend their time on work

30:07 that's actually strategic,

30:09 work that's actually going to move

30:10 the needle for our partners,

30:12 and we built a suite of agents

30:14 within the team that are doing the work

30:16 that it would take teams of analysts to do.

30:20 So it's been a big unlock,

30:22 and these numbers are very much showing up

30:24 in our metrics.

30:26 So over the last close to a year and a quarter,

30:32 we've seen so much growth within our book,

30:34 our revenue has gone up by about 2.5x,

30:38 our loan book has grown by 150%,

30:43 and our losses have actually improved.

30:45 Newer cohorts are materially lower loss rates

30:50 than cohorts from a year ago,

30:53 and we've done that by barely increasing

30:56 the team size by about four or five

31:00 additional folks on the team.

31:03 So we've been able to accomplish so much more

31:07 from the existing team

31:09 and accelerated so much of our roadmap

31:11 from next year to this year.

31:14 It's been really, really fun to see that.

31:18 I want to go back to the first half

31:21 of what you're mentioning as well,

31:23 because I think that's so important.

31:24 It's been the biggest topic I've been speaking on

31:27 that mostly your AI strategy

31:30 is more of a data model problem.

31:32 So can you organize the data?

31:35 Can you build the semantic layer?

31:37 Can you build the context graph

31:38 where AI agents can actually make sense

31:40 of the data, connect the dots?

31:42 And I think it sounds like you've seen

31:45 a tremendous amount of value from that investment.

31:49 Tyler, I'm curious if you're seeing the same thing

31:51 on the go-to-market tech stack side as well,

31:56 and seeing that investment unlock productivity

31:59 on the GTMT.

32:01 Massively, actually, yeah.

32:02 And I think one thing I'll mention is,

32:04 Lalitha touched on observability,

32:07 and I think that's from my seat.

32:09 Also, when I talk to partners,

32:10 we have some partners that are fully AI-pilled,

32:13 and some of which were the other side of the scale.

32:16 And an answer to a question can never be,

32:19 that's what the agent told us, right?

32:22 We have to be able to show our work,

32:24 and yes, we want to move fast,

32:25 and they love the outcomes,

32:26 but sometimes they want to be able to tick and tie

32:30 if they really need to,

32:31 if it really comes down to it.

32:32 And so that observability is incredibly important as well.

32:36 What's happening, how do we drive growth,

32:38 and how is it impacting us?

32:39 One example I'll give is we just rebuilt this year,

32:42 just launched an entirely new MarTech stack

32:46 that allows us to really massively increase

32:50 the level of personalization

32:53 to drive much faster cycle times,

32:56 due to integrations with Snowflake,

32:58 and into our platform.

33:00 So all the data modeling,

33:01 and all the access to data

33:02 that Lolita is talking about for the risk models,

33:04 we're also feeding into,

33:05 how do we drive certain behaviors

33:07 and outcomes for our partners

33:09 across all of the brands that we have, right?

33:12 So we have more than a dozen brands that are live today.

33:17 At the end of the day though,

33:18 the number of actions is not that different,

33:21 at least in the first couple of weeks

33:22 of having a credit card, right?

33:24 I need to use my card,

33:25 I want to add it to my digital wallet,

33:27 drive my first transaction,

33:28 how do I earn and redeem rewards the first time?

33:31 But I go back to we have to make that feel,

33:33 look and feel just like it is

33:35 as if it's coming from these 100 year old brands,

33:39 where these customers have deep relationships.

33:43 And doing that at scale,

33:44 it's been a massive challenge in our history, right?

33:47 As we add new partners,

33:48 it was almost entirely manual to scale these things.

33:51 Now we can do that in a fully AI enabled platform

33:55 with access to the data,

33:57 one click to drive a whole new design implementation

34:01 in our Martech stack,

34:03 and then actually get the comms out to customers

34:06 and see the behavior change or not.

34:08 Sometimes it doesn't, right?

34:10 We wish it always did,

34:11 we wish we always got it right, but we don't.

34:13 And that's okay because that cycle time is so fast

34:17 in this new environment

34:19 that we can learn and improve these things,

34:21 but also it allows us to scale brands

34:25 and add more brands without scaling headcount

34:27 in a linear way, right?

34:28 So from a design team, from an analytics team,

34:32 from a Martech enablement and ops team,

34:35 we haven't really had to scale that headcount

34:40 as we've added new brands, especially over the past year.

34:43 So that's been a huge improvement and unlock for us

34:46 while still driving the outcomes that we want, right?

34:48 And seeing the outcomes that we need for our partners.

34:52 Well, and I think sometimes people

34:53 don't really realize the magnitude

34:56 of improving the cycle time,

34:57 improving the conversion rate of these things,

34:59 just a few points.

35:00 And if you can leverage AI to do that,

35:04 I mean, the investment beyond pays for itself

35:07 once you've done that.

35:08 And I just wanna make a comment

35:09 on something you said earlier,

35:10 'cause I think it's an interesting time

35:13 where people are putting together AI slop documents

35:19 and putting a lot of AI slop content out into the universe.

35:22 And I've actually seen, I saw Clay,

35:26 the enrichment solution for GTM teams,

35:29 they just put out an announcement

35:32 that they have a company policy on AI written content

35:36 that if you publish something with your name on it,

35:39 then you are accountable for everything

35:41 that's written in there.

35:42 And they even have guidelines on,

35:44 hey, more isn't more.

35:46 So don't just keep creating giant documents

35:49 and thinking that it feels thorough.

35:50 But I do think we're getting into this era

35:52 where people are gonna have to kind of reel that back

35:54 and then really own any content they put their name on.

35:58 That so resonates actually with what we've seen

36:02 in terms of our evolution of using AI as well.

36:05 So actually one of the leaders on my team did this analysis

36:08 where we were seeing,

36:10 clutter adoption was skyrocketing.

36:13 The number of proposals and new strategy recommendations

36:17 that were coming my way for review were increasing as well.

36:22 But what we saw is that the length of the documents tripled.

36:26 The number of charts in the document

36:30 came down dramatically

36:31 because Claude likes to work more with tables.

36:34 So as a result of that, we actually did think about

36:38 how do we put guidelines here in terms of best practices?

36:42 Charts are a great way to also sanity check numbers

36:45 and intuition and build intuition

36:48 about whether the proposal makes sense as well.

36:52 So we actually went through that phase and chapter.

36:55 So that very much resonates with me.

36:58 We also had instances where we would have mistakes

37:00 and then we would hear Claude got it wrong.

37:03 And it's really, Claude is amazing

37:07 and Claude is a great coworker

37:09 that helps you drive better outcomes.

37:11 But the accountability has to be with the individual.

37:16 Did anyone ever say Excel got it wrong?

37:19 Has that ever happened?

37:20 Never was an acceptable answer ever.

37:24 I love how this has been personified.

37:28 Your name is on the document.

37:29 You own every word in it.

37:30 Use the tools to get there faster

37:32 and help refine the data and your ideas.

37:34 But you have to own the outcome

37:37 and you have to own the recommendation word for word.

37:40 And if that's not what you're comfortable with,

37:43 don't ship it.

37:45 Whether to me, a coworker or a partner especially, right?

37:49 And so that to me is incredibly important.

37:52 I talk about that to my team.

37:54 It's part of my, when I onboard new people on my team,

37:57 it's one of the things we talk about directly.

37:59 We have amazing tools.

38:01 We have access.

38:02 We live in the future, let's be honest, right?

38:04 But that doesn't mean that you can ship something

38:07 that you're not proud of

38:08 or you don't feel ownership over, ever.

38:11 And I think it's incredible.

38:12 It wasn't even acceptable to say,

38:13 "Hey, the intern got it wrong."

38:15 I don't care if the intern got it wrong.

38:16 You're the one presenting it to the board.

38:18 You're the one presenting to the executive team.

38:20 You own it.

38:21 Yep, a hundred percent.

38:23 So I think it's incredibly important,

38:25 especially in partner facing roles too, right?

38:27 Because then it's not the tool got it wrong

38:29 and it's imprint got it wrong.

38:32 That's right.

38:32 And I think having that mentality kind of across the board

38:35 always helps drive that accountability.

38:38 I'm curious, you all have done a tremendous job.

38:41 I love seeing the partnership.

38:42 I love how you're leveraging risk as a lever for growth

38:47 and really approaching the market as one team.

38:51 I would love to hear what is next for imprint

38:55 and what is next for your go-to-market motions

38:57 and how you're going to take care

38:58 of your customers and partners.

39:00 I mean, I think what's next is really building

39:02 out new capabilities and adding new products.

39:06 So I mentioned sort of earlier,

39:09 this concept of you need both the behavioral outcomes

39:11 but the scale so that it matters, right?

39:14 And so in a world where we have unsecured credit cards

39:18 as our core product, which is the world we live in today,

39:22 it's impossible for us to serve all of our partners customers

39:25 and to help them build relationships

39:27 with all of their customers.

39:29 And so we are focused really, really deeply

39:32 on how do we bring products to market?

39:34 How do we drive integrations with our partners,

39:38 no matter where they are

39:39 and what level of capability they have within their ecosystem

39:43 that allows them to serve and deepen relationships

39:45 with all of their customers, not just a slice of them.

39:50 So we have some exciting things coming later this year

39:52 and in next year that will help us do that.

39:55 I wish we could talk a little bit more about them today

39:57 but we're not quite ready to do that.

40:00 And I'll just add to that, definitely,

40:05 with all the AI adoption as well,

40:07 we are shipping at a very rapid clip as well.

40:11 So lots of exciting updates coming here.

40:14 But I will say, again, in this era of potentially

40:21 just everything changing in terms of how consumers interact

40:25 with brands, it's going to be harder and harder

40:28 to compete on things like pricing

40:31 and product features alone.

40:34 So you have to kind of really, like I said,

40:37 go back to those data insights

40:39 that can drive deep personalization.

40:42 And I think we are really uniquely set up

40:44 to be that data payments and customer intelligence platform

40:50 for these really large brands to drive every day's spend

40:55 and drive habituation and ultimately drive better outcomes

41:00 for the customers and also our brands.

41:04 And building off of what Lalitha said,

41:05 one of the things we're really excited about today

41:08 is we announced our new partnership with Kroger

41:11 and went live with that program.

41:13 Kroger is the largest standalone grocery store

41:15 in the United States.

41:16 They have a national presence

41:18 across more than a dozen brands

41:22 and are one of the premier partners

41:24 for driving every day's spend

41:26 in relationships with their customers.

41:27 And so we've got a new program in market

41:30 that we announced today

41:31 and really excited to grow that over the coming years

41:35 and looking forward.

41:38 Huge congratulations.

41:39 That's a massive win.

41:41 And I think really just a testament

41:43 to everything that we're talking about here.

41:45 How you're going to market, how you're partnering as a team,

41:47 how you're differentiating in the market as well.

41:50 So just a huge congratulations to landing that logo.

41:53 Well, I love the conversation we had today.

41:57 This is unique for the Lean Scale podcast

42:00 and I appreciate you both participating in this.

42:03 Seeing risk and revenue together on the same team.

42:07 I think it's a model for how companies

42:10 should be approaching this.

42:12 And everything you talked about

42:13 from how you align with your goals and incentives,

42:17 how you're really operating as one team,

42:20 aligned to the same target.

42:21 It's one imprint brand.

42:23 It's not different parts of the company

42:25 that are pointing fingers at each other.

42:27 And then really differentiating through technology and AI

42:30 and how you're taking care of your customers

42:32 and your partners. Amazing story.

42:34 You guys have had incredible success so far

42:36 and I cannot wait to see what you both do next.

42:40 So Lalitha, Tyler, thank you so much for being on the show.

42:43 And it sounds like we might have to catch up again

42:45 in the next six to 12 months to see how things are going.

42:48 Thanks so much. We're really excited.

42:50 I think we have a lot more to talk about next year too.

42:53 So looking forward to it.

42:55 Thank you so much. Such a fun dialogue.

42:57 Really appreciate you having us.

43:02 [BLANK_AUDIO]