Why You Can't Automate Reddit

0:00 If you're blind being using AI, whether Reddit, LinkedIn, Substack, or any of your content,

0:05 you're doing yourself so much of a disservice. I mean, maybe a year ago, it was okay because,

0:11 you know, less people were doing it. So, like, you know, you can get away with it,

0:15 but those patterns are starting to become much more and more clear.

0:18 And the model's getting smaller. It isn't going to change that, in my opinion.

0:23 My guests today are Sean Tenham and Lila Rest, the co-founders of Learbox,

0:28 a tool that turns Reddit into a real go-to-market channel.

0:33 Yeah, he's like, "By the way, I'm with my grandma. I didn't have much time to work,

0:36 but I quantized Gemma for 31B and optimized it for our use case.

0:42 I managed to have her running for 10X cheaper than via API."

0:46 This is back in March.

0:47 Super casual. Just a very average Sunday with my grandma.

0:51 Yeah, I'm quantizing a Gemma model over the weekend.

0:54 What do you think are some misconceptions, or how do you think people can take

0:59 advantage of the channel, especially in a B2B SaaS and AI context?

1:04 So, I would say one of the biggest misconceptions about Reddit, or, like, any channel right now

1:10 that you want to grow in, is almost like the need or the feel that you have to automate that process.

1:16 Like, distribution has always been a big thing, and you just said it, like,

1:21 before Sean talks, like, more than ever, you have to be connected with the audience.

1:26 You have to have empathy. You have to show, like,

1:30 you're really understanding the problems, because there's just so much noise.

1:43 Sean, you spent about 10 years as a plumber before any of this.

1:48 Take me back to the moment you got, as you put it,

1:51 cloud code-pilled, and how that turned into building Clearbox.

1:56 Right, yeah, absolutely. So, you know, being a plumber, I was always a builder first, right?

2:02 And part of, like, my whole persona or part of my branding while I was...

2:07 So, I went from plumber to SDR to founding BDR to cloud code-pilled, go-to-market engineer.

2:13 But I was always a builder at heart. I always wanted to, you know, take on this persona,

2:18 somebody who builds in public, and, you know, just, I would say it was around that

2:23 late December time where the models just got that much more intelligent.

2:27 You know, you had 4.5, 4.6 was coming out, and I just said I was tired of just, you know,

2:34 drag-and-dropping in tabs, and I wanted to actually start building stuff.

2:38 So, it's kind of like a funny story where I just took a YouTube video where somebody

2:44 was just telling you how to use cursor to build, and I wrote a post even on LinkedIn

2:49 where I was like, I built a meme generator in a weekend just because I needed to break something.

2:55 Because I was like, well, I'm not gonna, like, just upload or a CSV of all my client data or

3:01 my partner data and start just messing around like that. I need to, like, figure this out, like,

3:05 understand the UI, understand the differences between, you know, a coding agent and a coding

3:11 editor. And, you know, it's like what I tell anybody else that's trying to learn, go to market,

3:15 like, a code base, go to market engineering right now or programmable GTM, is you need the

3:21 time and the terminal, you need the time to really spend working with the agents, breaking things,

3:26 figuring it out, and then, like, okay, you get to that next phase and that next phase.

3:31 So, for me, it was really just, you know, having a laptop with a clay table open, a Slack,

3:36 a ClickUp, and five other, you know, Google Docs and just the computer moving at, like,

3:42 turtle speed. And I'm just like, man, I know what I'm doing, I know how to get to where I need to go,

3:48 but this isn't doing it. You start to hear about how you can use Cloud Code, not just to code for

3:53 you, but to, like, organize files, ensure that your memory is being used efficiently. And that

4:00 just kind of opened up that whole wormhole of, oh, what else can I do with this? Well, that next stage

4:05 was actually building a website and then building a website was, well, how do I get people to know I

4:10 even built one, right? So, Reddit kind of became that, like, initial channel where I was already

4:17 growing my brand on LinkedIn, but, you know, we all know how LinkedIn is. It's like you're shouting

4:22 into the void sometimes where the beauty of Reddit and it's what kind of really got me immersed into

4:28 it is that the communities or the cultures will tell you whether or not the content is relevant.

4:34 No one's fake there, right? If you drop a, you know, a blog post about how you built a website

4:40 using Next.js and Versal, people will read it and they'll give you their feedback. Some will be

4:45 good. Some will be like, I mean, I used to joke when I, when I first dropped in Cloud Code, this

4:50 website that I built and somebody wrote, like, yeah, he's got 40 features, but zero users.

4:56 I thought it was funny because, like, a lot of people outvoted, but a lot of people were defending

5:00 me at the same time and it just really gave you the idea of what, how Reddit works and how the

5:05 threads work and how the sentiment can really help you, like, shape what you're doing, right? Like,

5:12 you know, one of the biggest things I see in, like, the Reddit channels or specifically when it comes

5:17 to builders or people who are, like, you know, trying to build their own tools in AI or whatnot

5:22 is how do I get my first users? Where does that come from? And a lot of them will ask the question

5:28 on Reddit and I'm like, you're, you're kind of on the channel where you can find those users.

5:34 It's just about doing it the right way and being organic. It does take time. But in reality, the,

5:40 you know, I started using Reddit at the same time I got Cloud Code build and both just became hand

5:47 in hand. So, you know, you're six months later and yes, me and my co-founder who helped me build,

5:53 helped build this brilliant, brilliant product. But it's the fact that I'm also doing the go to

5:58 market engineering and sharing the workflows and the skills that, you know, just it makes it all

6:03 work together, I would say. So, yeah, that's just my part of it. Like, you know, from that question.

6:10 So, Lila, how did you end up getting involved? It sounded like you turned down the initial

6:15 co-founder courtship, but what got you over the line and had you jump in?

6:22 Yeah. So the previous startup I was working at, they're also good friends I've shown. And so we

6:28 met like two years ago without ever really talking. I knew his name, he knew my name, but yeah,

6:35 we never really had a talk. And when he started working on that, the same people, the same

6:40 co-founders, they just suggested him that he reach out to me so we can have a talk.

6:46 And we just started talking. Like I like, I like helping people. I'm just passionate

6:50 about solving problems and startups in general. So I'm like always keen to a good conversation.

6:56 And so at the beginning, yeah, it was very clear to me that I was not into jumping into a new

7:01 startup. I was already working on some stuff. My schedule was packed, and there was no room for

7:09 anything else. And then we have like this three, four weeks exchange time. And at the beginning,

7:15 Sean comes with this idea is like, I see the value, but there's like features everywhere.

7:20 And it's a bit overwhelming. And like we talked through it. And we come to that version that is

7:27 like super minimal, doesn't try to do anything, but tries to just like, deliver the opportunity,

7:32 the opportunity, like you have just an inbox. And the places you should spend your time on,

7:38 on Reddit, they just land here. And it's, it's almost no learning curve, because everyone knows

7:44 what a mailbox is. And I started getting excited. I remember I started getting excited about this

7:49 idea. And I'm like, maybe it's a good time investment for me, maybe I should spend two,

7:54 three weeks with Sean, I build that the guy looks solid on the GTM side and end up like starting

8:01 building that that product, it takes of course, a little bit more time than expected took me like a

8:05 month and a half to get to what third boxes today. But yeah, that's how we went. And since then the

8:12 product is mainly the same now we are iterating on distribution and messaging and how to actually

8:18 introduce you to the market. So I know Reddit is a very unique world. And I think some people

8:26 just get it or some people haven't even stepped into it. But I think it's where the real operators

8:33 and the real builders are living. I think there's a lot of LinkedIn famous people, I might be one of

8:39 the people contributing to the noise that's out there in the void. But the people who are really

8:43 building are on Reddit. What do you think are some misconceptions? Or how do you think people

8:50 can take advantage of the channel, especially in a B2B sass and AI context? So I would say one of

8:57 the biggest misconceptions misconceptions about Reddit, or like any channel right now that you

9:02 want to growing is the almost like the need or the feel that you have to automate that process.

9:08 Right. Like, you know, especially you're in the go to market space, it's like we want to automate

9:11 everything we want to automate LinkedIn's now we want to with AI, we can like create content packs,

9:16 we can, you know, send cold email that's personalized to every single person. And the

9:22 more we do that, the less trust I see we build, not just on Reddit, but just on everything like

9:27 you can imagine, you get a cold email where somebody's mentioning, you know, the company

9:32 that you left six months ago, and they're like, Hey, you know, what are you guys doing at x,

9:36 and it happens all the time. And it's like, if you just like rather than focusing on that

9:41 personal is a I know I'm going in a little more into the cold email side, but it applies even more

9:46 on Reddit, because LinkedIn is, in my opinion, a lot less. What's the word? There are a lot chill

9:56 more chill when it comes to people using AI, they're not going to call you out on it as much.

10:01 Now, mind you, I believe that you should be as genuine as possible, you use AI to get you to that

10:06 like 80% point where you have like a template, or you have an idea, or maybe you did the research

10:12 to back up your thesis. But it should be you the human that's either posting or commenting. And

10:18 with Reddit, it's even more important because, aside like LinkedIn, you know, somebody can like

10:24 your vote, or they can just scroll past it. On Reddit, they can downvote it, they can comment,

10:29 hey, this is AI slop, or they can complain to a moderator and get you banned for it. So it's like,

10:37 you know, and I always say this to anybody that's like a user, I'm like, you know, I get it, the

10:41 concept is you're online, and you want to talk and you want to be smart, and you don't want people to

10:46 call you out for, you know, being incorrect. But specifically on Reddit, and I'm actually seeing

10:52 this on LinkedIn, too, when I comment is being imperfect, but just being genuine and just showing

10:58 that you're you showed up, and you gave your opinion will always just get a higher end reaction.

11:05 You know, a lot of us we chase virality and hooks and, like, especially on LinkedIn with

11:10 trying to pack as much into a comment as possible. I think I'd rather get a comment that has 50

11:16 impressions to 100. But the three, four people that actually read it understood that this guy

11:23 tried and he those guys might try and hire you. Like, you know, and it's the same vibe where

11:29 LinkedIn and Reddit where you see the patterns, when people use AI to comment, where it's almost

11:35 like contrived in a way where, like, if, like I have certain people like they'll comment on my

11:40 post on LinkedIn and Reddit, and it's the same person, I don't even have to read the comment to

11:45 know what the style or the phrasing is going to be. And it's just like, you know, I sometimes I'm

11:52 like, I want to be like, yeah, hey, guys, maybe you want to figure a better way to do this. But,

11:57 you know, that's the other issue. It's like, how do you, you know, educate people on that

12:01 without offending them. So my best way to do that is just by leading by example, right? Like,

12:07 I built a Reddit growth playbook that I share with a lot of our that I share with all our

12:12 users. It's on my website. And the cool thing about that is because I'm not a go to market

12:16 I'm gonna go to market engineer, he's the AI engineer, I can actually just give him that

12:20 code, and he's able to actually input it into the landing page. And so that's the other beauty of

12:27 the dynamic of how we work together. You know, I'm not just like, I mean, I'm a co founder,

12:32 but I'm not just like a seller, I literally have been in the in the weeds the last two years

12:38 working with API is working with data and like creating data relationships. So I think that was

12:43 another appeal to Lila when working with me because, you know, like I said, he has his projects,

12:48 he has his things and knowing that he has somebody on the team that can take in not I mean, look,

12:55 I'm not trying to build features on a clear box. But being that ultimate, you know, hey, this is

13:01 certain things we can phrase or say and give him real examples based on user input, I think is like

13:07 another huge moat that we have together. But yeah, all this to say, like when it comes to

13:13 how I view Reddit or really any growth channel right now is make sure at the end of the day,

13:19 that it's your voice that is pressing send or, you know, you had that input. If you're blindly

13:25 using AI, whether for Reddit, LinkedIn, sub stack, or any of your content, you're doing yourself so

13:31 much of a disservice. I mean, maybe a year ago, it was it was okay, because, you know, less people

13:36 were doing it. So like, you know, you can get away with it. But those patterns are starting to become

13:41 much more and more clear. And the models getting smarter isn't going to change that, in my opinion.

13:47 I agree. I like that Reddit is a community that holds each other accountable. I'd actually really

13:52 like to see LinkedIn put in a dislike button. I think a lot of us could use that on the platform.

13:58 But but I think you're right. I think there's there's a really high value to the currency of

14:04 authenticity right now. And I think AI is exasperating that dynamic, where Reddit really

14:13 holds that true. I'm curious, though, Lila, maybe in your perspective, this is a relatively complex

14:21 product to build in a meaningful way. And how do you make sure that you're building something

14:28 that isn't setting up your customers for failure, or just getting banned out of the Reddit community

14:34 altogether? Yeah. So just to add on the previous question, which also answers this one, I think

14:42 it's important to see that Reddit is a player highly incentivized to keep his content as human

14:47 as possible. LinkedIn, they're making their money from ads, and they're making their money from

14:52 subscriptions. Reddit, they make most of their money with data contract with Google and for

14:56 picking up an AI. So Reddit will be very picky at what is high quality content. And first of all,

15:06 lately, we've seen like the call email subreddit being entirely banned, because it was not properly

15:11 being moderated. And that's a very good signal. Because you have like multiple layers. First,

15:16 you have like Reddit company, highly incentivized at keeping its contest to its content of the

15:22 highest quality possible, then you have the moderators that maintain a specific subreddits

15:27 same, if they don't keep their content fine, they'll get banned by Reddit. And people will go less on

15:34 the subreddit because they will not be satisfied with what they're reading and the community

15:39 overall. So it's like you have multiple layers of people that are highly incentivized to keep the

15:45 content of high, like at highest quality possible. And I think to answer your second question, this is

15:54 exactly what is important in Reddit. You should not aim for automation like sending hundreds of

15:59 comments on Reddit every day. What clearbox delivers is all the places where else someone

16:06 is mentioning the problem you solve, else the competitor is engaging, or other similar topics

16:13 where you could bring value without pitching your product. When you have this data, what

16:19 what you want to do is like give it to Claude, Claude or chat DPT or whatever automation you want

16:25 to understand where you should spend your time today. For example, let's say you have like 100

16:30 opportunities. And five of them are on very big subreddits and the thread is already like going

16:36 viral, like 5000 impressions and a lot of votes and it's been only 15 minutes, you want to comment on

16:43 this one, you want to be there, you know, because you know, this thread is going to go viral and more

16:48 and more people will come and read it, it will reference on Google, it will be visible on Claude

16:53 and open AI like and chat DPT. So that's a matter of like, doing less, but at the right place and

17:03 writing like human contents. I think that's the most important part. So even when we have this

17:09 feature where people can export clear box opportunity to their Claude and chat DPT or whatever

17:14 agent, we include an impromptu like we discourage actually the agents to help the user writing

17:21 message, we encourage the agent to educate the user about prioritizing their time and then writing

17:28 like high value content. I think that's the most important part of like being successful on Reddit,

17:34 because it really sucks when you get one account banned, you have to build your reputation again,

17:38 you have to build karma. You really don't want that. On the other hand, like if you're just posting

17:44 just 510 times a day, but you do right, you're gonna have like the cumulative effects of your

17:51 work every day because more people are going to see it is going to be visible to AI agents.

17:56 And you will even find direct leads, like on clear box, you have direct leads, there's

18:01 hands of people, for example, on our first week of using clear box for clear box, because like 70

18:07 leads, just for ourselves, like 70 people clearly mentioning on on Reddit, I need help with

18:14 distribution and help with Reddit marketing. And just that, even if you ignore competitors and

18:21 game engagement opportunities, it's already like so much value, especially if you're an early

18:26 business trying to validate your market trying to find your first customers, it's just people

18:29 openly complaining about the problem you solve. I'm curious, internally, who tend to be the

18:39 operators who are going in responding to these subreddits, prioritizing those or go to market

18:47 engineers handling this? Is a marketing team handling it? Do you need product experts?

18:52 How are you seeing teams kind of operationalize this strategy?

18:57 It's a good question. So what we're very much seeing is and it's funny, because we just had

19:02 this conversation before the call, as far as, you know, really where the value sits for go for

19:07 clear box, because if you're like, I'm a go to market engineer. So for me, like, or for the few

19:12 go to market engineers that are working with the tool, it really is the API, it's being able to

19:17 pull it out and be able to a know who, like, if I have 70 opportunities, I want at minimum,

19:24 me personally, like, I want to comment at least five times a day naturally.

19:29 But then there's, you know, there could be 60, depending on my offering, and depending on the

19:33 amount I have, there might be other things that I want to do with that data, maybe I want to create

19:39 content for SEO, geo purposes, because a lot of the posts and the content that, you know,

19:47 how, where do I find my first users on Reddit, or something like that, that can be reverse

19:52 engineered into how to find your first, you know, users on Reddit as a, you know, in a blog format.

20:01 And for me, it's easy, because it's like a very easy channel to find people that are looking

20:07 for this. But we also have users that have very like niche tech, like we have a user that's also,

20:14 she's a consultant for a law firm, and she's also building her own law tech. So while she's able to

20:21 read some subreddits like, like our SaaS and startup where, you know, it's not about law tech,

20:30 but people are asking about compliance laws and things like that, she's able to use that data,

20:36 where it's not maybe a direct lead, or there can be. So, you know, the API in that sense is like,

20:42 my opinion, it's probably one of the strongest things. Also, I feel like we are coming into this

20:47 place where as important is to have a valid UI that shows and shares with your teams, the real

20:53 operators that are coming in, are saying, hey, what can I do with the API that keeps that I can

21:00 respect the UI, but I have 100 other processes, I'm connected to Slack, like, like I said, when I,

21:06 when I when I left my agency, it's because, you know, you're connected to Slack, ClickUp,

21:11 chatgbt as a chat, Claude, and whatever other five other tools, and they were all siloed.

21:19 And this was like back in like December last year, then it started being, oh, I can do this

21:24 with cursor and MCPs. And that was cool. But then you would hit limits. And I was like,

21:30 hard to justify telling my agency that I spent $200 in the first week of just like in Richmond.

21:36 So I ate that one up. But that's how I learned more about context engineering, how you can,

21:42 like really use the APIs and the terminal and the CLI. And it was like, oh, we can do this with

21:48 Reddit. But like, I also joke that the first time I tried to grow on Reddit, I tried to automate the

21:54 process. I tried to see if I can get the Reddit API, because Claude will tell you, yeah, you can

21:59 just get it. And it might take you 24 hours, mind you, 24 hours, maybe $10,000. But Claude failed

22:06 to mention that, which is a funny story. And I wasn't the only one who went through that whole

22:11 thing. So it was funny just seeing other people do it. But my best thing was a weekend where I just

22:16 said, screw it. I'm going to really just go into the channels and just scroll and speak is how I

22:22 called it. I was like, if I don't have nothing to say, I won't say it. If there's something

22:26 interesting and I can share value or share my take or my advice, I would. And literally it was about

22:33 three, four days. And again, with Reddit, there's this thing called the karma gate. Right. So you

22:39 gain karma by people upvoting your comments or your posts. But usually most subreddits won't

22:46 accept you to even post until you have at minimum, say like 50 karma to 100. Some are about 100.

22:53 So, you know, the idea is like with clear box, you can absolutely use it to build your karma

22:59 and grow your community because we're basically we're sharing the the places that you can scroll

23:06 and speak without having to think. And on top of that, the AI becomes more of a suggestive engine

23:12 and then just another data layer that can say, hey, this is what my buyers are talking today.

23:17 Right. Like, you know, I look at it like this. If you're reading clear box for your ICP

23:23 and maybe, you know, your ICP or sales folks and, you know, you can imagine in Q1 right before

23:31 President's Day, you know, President's Club comes in. Those subreddits might have a lot more data or

23:39 sentiment onto something. Right. You know, the seller is trying to close his quota, but he's

23:44 complaining about I can't find the 10 deals in my CRM. He might mention that more and then might

23:50 have more people agree with him on, you know, different seasonal times. Right. You know,

23:55 Christmas or summertime. Things are slow right now. People are on vacation. It's like,

24:00 what are what are your buyers talking about during the summertime? And then it's like,

24:04 yeah, there are leads, but they're also, you know, content. And one of the biggest also things I

24:10 always say to people about the lead or the person asking for your tool in Reddit is it's not just

24:17 one person because he's asking me in the subreddit. He's validating that that there's a need to the

24:23 10 or 50 or 100 other lurkers that might be just viewing that. So like I'm very much also the one

24:32 like me and him, we I share screenshots of him every day. And, you know, we roll back feedback.

24:38 One of my biggest things is I have a co-founder that I trust to the bone and not just on features,

24:45 but on email copy and everything. It's like, I don't send an email before I get his critique

24:51 on it. And then usually I will take his critique. And it was one of the hardest things for me

24:56 growing up was taking people's critique. So, you know, having a co-founder that I trust to the

25:00 point where, you know, I embrace the critique is almost like it's like an interesting factor. But

25:07 yeah, so I'll pause there on my point. No, I have a similar relationship with our COO who happens to

25:16 be my childhood best friend. He's the best fan of my wedding. He's the godfather of my kids. So him

25:22 and I are super close. And that is one thing that him and I do all the time. We'll screenshot a

25:27 Slack we're about to send. We screenshot an email we're about to send and be like, Hey, is this right?

25:32 And I think the people you trust, they have taste too. Like, Oh, this word, don't use that word.

25:37 That's kind of an applying XYZ or take that out, or don't use the punctuation this way. We used to

25:43 use them dashes a lot. Now we take them all out because people think that we use AI to write

25:47 everything. But I think it's important to have that relationship. And I think that is something

25:54 where it's important to eat. And I don't, I don't necessarily think you should manufacture this too

26:02 much. But it is important to signal that this thing that's being written is authentic. And on Reddit

26:10 in particular, I think that's going to be really important for you to get upvotes, keep your karma

26:13 where you need it to be. What are some of the biggest ways you could fail at Reddit? Because I

26:20 assume there are so many companies that go, all right, awesome. There's lots of leads, lots to

26:27 build the pipeline up and Reddit. So we're just going to go all out and start blasting into the

26:34 Reddit world. And I'm assuming they just kind of run themselves into brick wall. If you were giving

26:40 any advice to a company, that's like, all right, I'm going to start start making Reddit a part of

26:44 our strategy. What are like the top things that you need to absolutely avoid? I would say so A is

26:51 absolutely making sure you do the research as far as which are the right subreddits where,

26:56 you know, the people that are going to interact with you are there are subroutes, like, especially

27:02 if you're, you're some you're in B2B sass, you're a marketer, you are trying to grow, you are going

27:08 to be trying to promote in any in some capacity or the other. So you have to kind of be able to read

27:13 that room where, you know, there's new subreddits popping up every day that do embrace sharing

27:18 build sharing promotion. But one thing I do always say, like a lot when a user asked me should I buy

27:25 warmed accounts or buy multiple accounts? And I say no to that. The reason why is one strong

27:32 account, I didn't even know that was a thing. Is there is there a marketplace for warmed up Reddit

27:36 accounts that yeah, you can go by are a few companies I won't name names. But yeah, it's

27:42 just one of those things where they either have built their own accounts, and then they'll use

27:46 them to help up your community. But Reddit is very, very like onto that. It's like, in a way

27:54 where they're looking to catch you, right? They're looking for the gotchas. But if you don't have any,

27:58 then you're almost like free reign. Like one of the biggest things I always recommend with Reddit

28:03 to to like users is diversify yourself. Meaning, you don't just have to use Reddit as a growth

28:08 channel, you can just use it for your own personal, like interest or gains. Like for example, I love

28:15 this one example where I bought a new digital camera a few months back. And it was like a Fujifilm,

28:22 but I just bought the bare camera and I needed a lens for it. So I was like, I don't know which lens

28:26 to buy. I'm like new to photography, I'm trying to figure it out. So Google, hey, I just bought the

28:31 Fujifilm XM5. What's the best lens for me to do in room vlogging? Sure enough. Four different

28:38 citations all from Reddit threads where real users are giving real advice as far as, yeah, no,

28:45 you can use the pancake lens, but this is going to be the trade off. And then you get like an AI

28:50 consensus on, hey, this is your budget of these four. This is probably the best one. And I'm like,

28:56 I trust that. I bought that lens based on that recommendation. But it was real. It's like, you

29:02 know, people in those channels aren't necessarily going to use AI slop to give recommendations

29:06 because it's natural to them to be helpful, right? Like, oh, somebody's asking about the Fujifilm,

29:12 I bought it three months ago. It was awesome. Let me tell them about it. And I think that same concept

29:17 can very much apply to B2B SaaS. And for me, it does. Like I very much like, I have one company

29:24 that I like, I have a signed contract with as a vendor where I, you know, I do content for them,

29:29 but I do content about pretty much every single tool I use. If the tool helps me win or helps me

29:36 get from point A to point B 30 minutes faster than it would have been like six months ago,

29:41 and I'm going to promote it on LinkedIn on Reddit, and I'm going to share the value. So it's like,

29:47 yeah, I share value on clearbox, but because I diverse and I share value on so many other

29:53 aspects, no one's going to call me an astroturfer or say that because I'm not one. I genuinely use

29:58 the channel, not just for selfish reasons. And I think that's one of the biggest advice is I can

30:05 give people is, you know, like, it's like anything else, right? You get what you give, and that's why

30:10 it's called karma too, right? I think karma is one of the best names you can give something like this

30:14 because karma is a real thing, you know, you give, you get. And the other big thing, like I've seen

30:22 is like, you know, everybody thinks, oh, you have to backlink on Reddit in order for people to

30:26 cite you. You actually don't even have to backlink. If I just reference clearbox in a useful way,

30:33 like, Hey, I found this thread. I'm also using my own tool clearbox, which helps me surface

30:37 the right leads. I don't have to say clearbox.to. A will get cited. And B, I see a lot of times

30:45 people will just genuinely be like, Hey, can I get the link? So, you know, dropping a link in

30:52 certain channels is perfectly acceptable. But I'm always and I and this is part of what I share in

30:57 my playbook is live examples, because, you know, I build and I post on Reddit because I like it.

31:03 But I also feel like it's not like, like, almost like not the obligation, but one of my duties as

31:08 somebody who's, you know, building in the space in Reddit, like, why should you buy my tool if I

31:13 can't prove that I'm using it to grow, right? So that was a big, that's a big thing for me. And

31:20 that's why I'm like, you know, I built this Reddit playbook. And I think it's on like v4, because,

31:25 you know, I use quad code to build websites and five code the websites. But my biggest thing is,

31:30 I don't say, Claude, build me a website, I say, let's go through five, let's go into plan mode.

31:36 And I want to run this through six phases until I'm absolutely happy with five different tests on

31:42 the dev server before we push it into production. And I won't forget, I was still like dissatisfied

31:48 with the playbook, but I shared it with Leela and his, the way he embraced it, and the way he liked

31:54 it was like my, okay, this is something, you know, like, I'm a go to market engineer, and I can love

31:59 everything I do. I need to hear from the person that I know will criticize me when he's when it's

32:04 off. And it's like another thing I always say is like, if the person that's like on your team or

32:10 is your co founder is always agreeing with you, that's probably the wrong co founder, you need

32:14 somebody that's going to disagree and keep you honest. Because if he just agrees with everything,

32:20 how do you know that he's, he's being real when he actually does like something?

32:25 Yep, yep. And which it, you know, the Reddit community is like that pretty authentic, they'll

32:29 give you the positive, they'll give you the negative. One thing tactically, I'm curious,

32:35 the best way to approach this in most social platforms, business pages don't do very well.

32:41 If you're looking at LinkedIn, if you're looking at meta, like the company page itself,

32:47 usually is a poor performing page. So what tends to happen is you have people on the team that have

32:53 presence on that platform that tend to lead the charge. The only issue is, of course, if they end

32:59 up switching companies going somewhere else doing their own thing, they tend to take a lot of that

33:04 with them. Is it a similar concept on Reddit? Or do you sometimes see companies pull off useful,

33:14 like company specific users that can really stay with the business as it grows?

33:21 I would say yes and no, like on Reddit, a lot of people are anonymous. But the way you're speaking,

33:28 like people they want to people want to talk to people. That's why you were saying like,

33:32 on X, for example, company accounts, organization level accounts, they tend to perform well, worse

33:39 compared to like personal branding, like having the CEO, the CPO, or even like the engineers of

33:45 the company talking about the product. It's just because you can connect to people. And on Reddit,

33:52 it's pretty much the same, like Sean was talking about sharing links. If you're just on a Monday

33:58 morning, you have a problem in your job, you go to Reddit, you ask a question, and you have like

34:01 five people answering with a link with a product that is like not exactly the solution that you

34:07 were looking for. It's just you're not going to engage with that. And you might even report

34:12 these people. It was not like it's about advertisement. It sounds like advertisement.

34:17 So I think on Reddit, it's different because most of the time people prefer to stay anonymous.

34:26 So you don't really know if it's a person or a company, you don't really know the context

34:30 of like the author. But the way they write is how you know if this is a company or not.

34:37 And to summarize what Sean was saying, I would say like, don't share your links,

34:42 don't share your products before people begs you about it. That's like the biggest rule on Reddit.

34:53 Are there any other etiquette items, Leela, that you think would be important for people to know?

34:57 So don't share your links, talk like a human, don't have AI, write your responses.

35:04 But anything else that people should be aware of if they're kind of stepping in for the first time?

35:09 Yeah, I think it's very easy to be excited and say, oh, I'm going to be on all subreddits and

35:13 posts everywhere, comments everywhere. You're just going to get banned. Because if you do that,

35:18 unless you have like a big team and you trust a lot of people to do copywriting, you'll have to use

35:22 LLMs. And I'm not saying this is not possible. For example, with Sean, we've been working on skills

35:28 that make like a cloud generating copy that looks pretty much human. And we're pretty satisfied

35:34 about it. But this is not something I would recommend because it requires like a lot of

35:39 prompt engineering before you can come to something that just looks close to human.

35:43 So I would say just don't be excited by the volume. There's so many opportunities, but start small,

35:48 start with like five to 10 comments a day. You can post also, that is a great way to talk about

35:55 your product or the problem you're solving. If you post about just pitching your product,

36:00 that's probably not going to work. Some communities accept it, some like accept like you share the

36:06 project you're building, some don't. So sometimes you want to post about the problem you're solving.

36:12 Like for example, let's say we are building on Reddit, so we know a lot of things about Reddit.

36:17 I could post on SaaS, the SaaS subreddit. I'm not going to come and say, "Hey, Clearbox is the

36:23 solution for distribution and everything." I'm going to come and say, like talk about the problem

36:28 we're solving. Like, for example, with AI and like all the noise, like everyone can create SaaS

36:34 right now. And it's very hard to distribute. And so I'm going to bring my insight on how I've been

36:40 using Clearbox Reddit in the last month to actually grow my SaaS. And people will ask in the comments,

36:48 like, I don't even have to share the link of my startup inside of the posts. Like people will just

36:54 share about it. I will engage with people. And the cool thing is that you know that if someone engages

36:59 with your posts, you know that person is possibly in the same boat. You just DM them. And you're like,

37:07 "Hey, by the way, I wrote that post and I ended up creating a solution, which is Clearbox." And

37:13 I think this is just the smartest way of doing it, you know, like just being a real human,

37:18 putting yourself in the shoes of the person commenting and asking for help. Yeah.

37:24 Yeah, I just think there's going to be so much temptation to try to scale this thing. And I

37:31 think it's just going to completely go up in flames for these companies that are not really like,

37:37 well, first of all, they have inauthentic motives for being in these channels. And I think you have

37:45 to have some type of approach where you're feeling like, "Hey, this is an opportunity for me to give

37:50 real value to the market." And make the bet that the business will come if you're doing a good job

37:57 at that. And it sounds like if you can at least hone in a particular brand voice or company voice

38:05 and keep it to a small group of people that genuinely enjoy responding to things and then

38:11 prioritizing things where they can add value to these problems, it's probably a good way to go.

38:16 And you could actually, in a lot of ways, this might be one of the few platforms you could build

38:22 a company dedicated user that can grow over time and doesn't leave with the person behind it.

38:34 Yeah, I actually looked at it like this. We have SDRs or sales reps today that they spent half

38:41 their day either cold calling and the other half sending automated emails through sales

38:44 love that don't even work anymore. Especially in the big... It's like, why not? If I was a business

38:50 development manager, why wouldn't I want to have my rep dedicate an hour a day to

38:56 being useful in a community like Reddit? Or even if it's not Reddit, somebody might be like a

39:01 sub stack or something. But that compounds in so many ways because now you have your people in the

39:08 weeds that are on... You're an SDR and you're calling a VP of sales or VP of finance. You might

39:15 know the product that you're trying to sell them, but you don't really understand that VP of sales.

39:19 You don't understand what he's feeling on Q3 when it's holidays and he's worried about his

39:25 reps hitting quota. So it's almost like it's so early and it's so new, but it's just, I guess,

39:34 maybe the SDR and then the go to market engineer in me is part of the reason why I valued Reddit

39:40 and saw the aha for me was that real sentiment into the buyers, what they're talking and how

39:47 they're talking. Cause it's like all go to market engineers. We all know we can build a copy. We can

39:53 get the best email infrastructure possible. We can make sure the list is great. But do you know what

40:00 those buyers really care about just based on the features and everything? Maybe, but especially

40:05 like I worked for an agency where I had seven to eight clay workspaces and then every single one,

40:12 it was like, I spent more time focusing on, you know, getting the right copy and the right variables

40:18 than I did building out the infrastructure that includes two weeks of warmup and everything else

40:24 involved. So, um, you know, it's so early, but I really do see a world where like reps really

40:30 understand that they can use Reddit correctly for their words to, you know, a like just be involved

40:36 share. Like, you know, you have, um, you know, an audit list of like the best tech stack for finance,

40:42 um, operators that they should use it in, in February or whatever, like things like that you

40:48 can find and it will be on Reddit. And the beauty again about Reddit is that karma threshold and

40:53 that ratio. So meaning if the post is valid and it's good and it's useful and you want to extract

41:00 it, you're not going to extract it if it's been downvoted or everybody is just in the comments

41:05 saying this is AI slop. But if everybody's saying, Hey, this is super cool. Can you share more or x,

41:11 y, like, Oh, maybe there's something here that, you know, I can reverse engineer and I can use

41:16 for my own copy or for my own, um, work. So it's like, we're, we're also, you know, we're talking

41:22 with certain companies that have their own orchestration layer tools, like a, like a deep

41:26 line or even clay where like I use clay for so long and you know, we would get the copy. We would do

41:32 the research. We would run clay agents to research every domain or a fire crawl to grab it. And that

41:39 gives you something, but it doesn't tell you anything about the person buying. Right. Um,

41:45 you know, you know, it's interesting. So, so many brands have deep empathy and love for their

41:55 customers that they just can't help but get involved in the community. And I think SAS companies

42:04 has been a, it's been a very, very interesting category where they didn't have to do that.

42:10 They just built something that was before a few years ago, difficult to replicate.

42:16 So they had a moat in the tech that they built and they could just kind of scale it and then

42:21 just scale through advertising, which is a very like at the time also cheap way to grow.

42:27 But now SAS, all of those advantages that kind of put it on this special pedestal of a category

42:35 have completely been wiped away. People can build their own products with Claude right away. There's

42:41 some production grade stuff, of course, that, that has a little bit of a moat, but they also have to

42:47 start having real domain expertise and differentiate with experience and differentiate with their

42:53 service and how they show up for customers and how they serve customers. And then I think

42:58 this final portion, the way SAS companies have to show up in their marketing has to be authentic.

43:05 It has to be real. It has to be connected to their customers. It can't just be this advertising

43:10 cannon that they hope people will click on the link and then buy the product. They have to really

43:16 put in the effort, which I think a lot of these SAS companies are just not used to doing.

43:22 Totally. I think when it comes to things like ads where like me and him, when we talk,

43:26 we'd love to do ads, but I want to do ads when I have messaging that already lands, right? Like,

43:31 it's like the whole Gary V concept where it's like, put like it with like TikToks and stuff.

43:36 You can do a hundred TikToks, but the ones that get those thousand that pass that threshold and

43:41 get high views, those are the ones you can double down, put the ads, put into real things because

43:46 the algorithm in that sense, like if you use it, right, it doesn't lie. It's like, if people are

43:52 scrolling past, that means you're not interesting. If they're scrolling for five seconds, maybe you

43:57 caught them on that first hook, but it's not interesting enough. So I'm very much like learning

44:03 all of those aspects of, you know, how to, you know, ensure that, you know, we share the value

44:09 of Reddit because it can be interesting, but it's also how you deliver it and how you share it.

44:14 Right. So it's like, you know, you know, when your co-founder signed up for Clearbox,

44:21 you know, normally that's like the product guys thing where he sees the signups, but, you know,

44:26 I'm a go to market engineer. I was like, Lila, let me get the, not just postdoc. I have the key to

44:31 convex, the read one, not write one, but just enough so I can understand our, our client data,

44:37 our product data, like who's using Clearbox the right way? Who's not? You know, ideally, I always

44:43 say like to every user, when I speak to them, I want you to win with this tool. Like, you know,

44:48 and because, you know, we're in that situation where Reddit as a growth channel is new, you know,

44:55 anybody else can build what we're building. It's not hard to build a Reddit scraper,

44:58 but not everybody can, not everybody has spent the last, you know, half a year really like diving

45:06 in, posting, commenting, interacting, engaging with people, testing things that work, showing

45:12 even the failures. Like I keep my posts and my comments all public for a reason because, you know,

45:19 while most of my posts and comments do good, some don't, some might have gotten down voted now,

45:23 leave it there because I'm not hiding anything. I want people to see what's working and what's not

45:28 working. I think that's super important, that transparency. And, you know, again, it's, we're

45:34 in an era where anybody can take a weekend with a cloud code session and really build something

45:39 cool, but can you distribute that? Can you make it secure? Can you sell it to other people? You know,

45:45 like my first user was Leela, fortunately. And that's, you know, that's why we got to this point,

45:52 like, you know, and yeah, so it's, it's, it's just really cool. But, you know, it's one of those

45:59 things where, you know, you do it right and you, you take the time and the research and that word

46:05 karma really does just come into play in so many ways with the, with the whole Reddit world.

46:11 Like distribution has always been a big thing. And, but you, you just said it like, before

46:17 shown talks, like more than ever, you have to be connected with the audience. You have to have

46:23 empathy. You have to show like, you're really understanding the problems because there's just

46:28 so much noise, like everyone can create a SAS in a few minutes. And that's true. Like anyone could

46:34 create like a clear box competitors in a minute, probably not in a minute, because the main value

46:41 we bring is cost optimization. So I think that's also a great insight. I know if this audience is

46:46 made of founders, but I've spent a lot of time in the last month questioning myself on where is the

46:54 place I can bring the most value to people in companies right now is SAS just dead. And I have

47:03 to move to something else is SAS evolving to something. And so my conclusion is that distribution

47:09 is more important than ever. And as you said, you need to like be with your audience, engage with

47:14 communities, advertisement, cold email, they still work. They're just very expensive, especially if

47:20 you're if you're starting. And the two other things is cost and speed. No one wants to learn

47:29 a SAS that is super complex. And you have like a huge learning curve, you have to work on it for

47:34 an entire month before you can get any value. And that's speed and costs like, first of all,

47:43 with Clearbox, if you wanted to ask cloud code right now, like build me a Reddit scraper, that

47:50 is going to surface up on the opportunities for my business, you can do it, you're going to plug like

47:55 API, whatever, and cloud is going to pull all that data and run else the cloud code SDK or whatever

48:04 model to analyze every single comment, it's going to cost you like $5,000 a month minimum. And on

48:10 Clearbox, it costs you $75 a month. Or you will have to use less precise approach like keywords

48:15 matching or semantic search, which we've discarded because they have shown to contain a lot of noise.

48:20 And when you open Clearbox, you know that 90% of the things you see, they're just signal, they're

48:26 just value, you might decide to invest your time on them or not. But at least you're not losing your

48:32 time on something that is clearly someone not talking about your problem or not your competitors

48:37 or not an engagement opportunity, you know, it's like, you have signal, then you decide.

48:43 So I think that's where SAS is going, enabling agents that enable people,

48:50 or like very minimalistic. First of all, I like the new product that Landlist is releasing. It's

48:56 like every day you get 10 leads, which are the 10 people in the market that today are have the

49:03 highest intent, basically in your product. It contrasts so much with like the previous model

49:09 of like building lists of 1000s of people and like reaching out to call the email is like no,

49:13 you just have 10 people and just focus your time on them. Because these people are already overwhelmed.

49:18 So find a way to reach out to them, give them a call, send them a message on LinkedIn,

49:24 build personalized message like this 10 people's they deserve your time more than the 1000s people

49:30 that were on your previous list. And I think this is where SAS is going, like cutting through the

49:36 noise, allowing people to do the same thing for like 500 times cheaper, allowing people to do

49:42 the same thing for just 10 minutes a day, instead of like hours a day, like if you had to scroll

49:48 Reddit every day, instead of using Clearbox, you would not do that. That would be just so

49:54 much time consuming with Clearbox, you just open your inbox, and you have all these opportunities

49:59 just sitting here for you. And that's like a no brainer, you know, like paying 75 bucks a month to

50:06 have all this value, like save $5,000, being able to just spend 10 minutes on Reddit every day and

50:13 make it one of your main distribution channel. That's like a no brainer, like $75, even less than

50:18 what you pay for lead agency, you know, for a single lead. So yeah, that's my vision of it.

50:25 I'm curious what you think about about all of that. I definitely do not think SAS is dead. I think

50:30 we're just going to get more sober valuations of what they're actually worth as a business and as

50:38 a company. And for all the reasons that you mentioned, so it takes time, even if you could

50:44 build it, I could build 20 billion things, it's possible for me to go into terminal and build

50:49 whatever the hell I want. It doesn't mean I should. There's a few things that are really core to me

50:56 and my business and things where we have exceptional domain expertise and exceptional value

51:04 that we have spent years going into potholes, tripping over ourselves and taking that experience

51:12 to build things that have all that experience baked in. And I think that's where SAS is going. I

51:17 think SAS is really going to move more to a service industry. So people who build these products,

51:25 they're really service companies because they're aiming, they're forming their expertise into

51:32 something that is repeatable, which is very similar to a consulting company or a service company.

51:39 Like you have all of your expertise, you build it into frameworks, you build it into things that

51:44 you can then use. Now it's just a new way of doing that. I think the foundations of SAS and AI are

51:52 almost like everyone has access to Excel. Everyone has access to PowerPoint or Google Sheets, Google

51:57 Slides, whatever. But that's not really the secret sauce. The secret sauce is what do you put on that

52:03 canvas and what problem are you aiming that brain power towards to solve for someone? And I think

52:10 that only comes when you have deep empathy for your customer, a group of people that are experiencing

52:15 a problem or they have aspirations and you build something that's just for them. And then you find

52:21 ways to get involved in the world that they're living. I think that's where SAS is going. And

52:26 I think that's a good thing. I think we had overvalued bloated valuations, people spending

52:33 money on nonsense. And now it's, hey, let's let the real companies adding value in the market

52:39 survive and they will. And it gives an opportunity to have even more diversity of product

52:45 and customization to meet the market's needs better.

52:52 I agree. It's like, you know, the concept that just because people are now using AI to build that

52:57 they're, you know, they're doing less or being less productive. Most people, if you ask them if

53:02 they've been in the terminal for the past six months, they're spending more hours building

53:06 and more time working and reiterating because now it's like, oh, there's so much more I can do,

53:12 you know, a software like I've spoken to real software, senior software engineers and,

53:18 you know, seven, eight years in the industry. And they're like, yeah, I embraced coding agents

53:23 two years ago and I haven't looked back. I'm more productive. I love my job more because

53:29 it lets me do more than I was ever capable. I've heard people say that they were CS majors and

53:34 dropped out of programming completely. And then once they started realizing they can do this with

53:39 coding agents, it's like, okay, this is how my brain works. It's like, my brain is not wired to,

53:45 you know, type out every single code base, but I understand programming. I understand the

53:49 functionality of, you know, the components and why this should click and this should turn this to

53:55 that. So, you know, the ability to be able to do that is just great, but there's also groundedness

54:01 into it too, right? Like, yeah, I five coded or, you know, built the features for the original

54:07 version, but I wasn't delusional, delusional enough to think that, Hey, I should just, you know,

54:12 go out in the market and try and sell this. Like, let me find the right team or the right person to,

54:18 you know, make sure that if we have a hundred people giving us a credit card, I'm not, you know,

54:23 letting somebody hack into my Mac mini and take that information, God forbid. So, you know, there

54:29 was that, but like, I would say this, he's too humble. One of the biggest things that he was

54:33 able to do for clear boxes. And in reality, this is why we're still even running right now is that

54:40 we have, he built his own local inference model. Like, I'm not sure if you're familiar with,

54:45 when Google released the Gemma model, it was a, it's a local open source model that they released.

54:52 And I can't tell the story like he can, but I'll just keep it short and he can maybe explain it

54:56 better, but he was able to quantize that model so that he can reduce the, you know, the math in it

55:02 and put it into a GPU that can run clear box for us. And it's funny cause I can look at the engine

55:09 every day and see the cost for, you know, if you have a thousand users and even if half of them

55:15 are on a paid trial and a lot of companies have that, if you're running on a chat UBT wrapper,

55:21 you can, you can lose your runway and go out really quick. And one of the, like it's, it's,

55:27 it's everything. It's not one of, but just, you know, the props to him, I'd love for him to explain

55:32 it a little better than I can, but I always joke back to the WhatsApp message. I can even just

55:37 read it real quick. I got from him in, I remember that one. Yeah. He's like, by the way, I'm with my

55:45 grandma. I didn't have much time to work, but I quantized Gemma for 31 B and optimized it for

55:52 our use case. I managed to have her running for 10 X cheaper than via API. This is back in March.

55:58 Super casual. Just a very average sizing a Gemma model over the weekend. He drops it on hugging

56:06 face. And I think now it's at almost a million downloads, but I'd love for him to just give you

56:11 like the TLDR on the story. Cause I think it's honestly one of the coolest things. Of course.

56:16 Yeah. I think this is a great insight also for this audience. Like,

56:20 and that also intersects with the value that SAS can provide with models, like

56:28 time and human labor can be automated. And that's the thing. And that's also very

56:32 counterintuitive with the fact that we were saying SAS are evolving towards service because service,

56:38 something that can be automated now, but it's not about automation like in SAS. It's about like

56:43 relationship and empathy as we were, as we were discussing, but there's a lot of, a lot of things

56:48 in a company that can be automated. And right now, if you use state of the art models, like

56:57 open AI and anthropic models, it's just going to be so expensive that it's almost discouraging

57:03 for you to invest the time of optimizing these processes. There is a huge potential at creating

57:10 small models that are very good at something like a thousand times cheaper than the models from the

57:15 big labs and like retain 95% of the intelligence on that specific task. And that's what we did.

57:23 Basically I took a model from Google. I made it much smaller so I can fit in a single consumer

57:28 GPU of 50, 90. That's why I went viral because people were hyped by the model and then they

57:33 realized they can run it on the GPU they have at home. And so just last month, I think he got like

57:38 600k than loads. Yeah, it went crazy. We got reposted by the hugging face and Google researcher.

57:47 And we got like a million views on Twitter just for that model. But that's a very great insight

57:54 for people like how can you help your users, your company do the same thing, the exact same thing

58:00 they're already doing, but for like much cheaper. And that's the cost aspect, you know, with Clearbox,

58:07 it will be very hard to leverage Reddit. If you had to do it yourself with like the big labs model,

58:14 it would just be too expensive. It would probably be fine for an enterprise. You don't mind paying

58:18 20k a month if it's going to bring you like 200k a year contracts here and there. But if you're a

58:26 startup, if you're anything lower than a big enterprise, you do mind. You don't want to spend

58:30 20k a month on something you don't know is going to work. And yeah, I think that's, that's definitely

58:38 something I'm even thinking of, like how there's this I see so many processes that can be automated

58:45 in companies. Yeah, there's things I cannot share, but I'm talking with big companies also. And

58:54 they're like, they're talking about this right now. And they're probably going to build that

59:00 internally. But I think there's a big potential for a startup assess also to come and optimize

59:06 the cost for them. I've seen something recently, what was that? Oh, was it post hog?

59:14 Yeah, I think post hog, you know, post hog, they're like pivoting right now. For a long time,

59:19 they were just this big analytics company plus things you can like tools to help running your

59:28 products, like feature flags, A/B testing and stuff like that. Now they're pivoting towards

59:34 this being this hub, where you can automate your entire business and keep track of all the agents.

59:39 And so your business will be auto improving. So your engineers, they don't spend time on like the

59:45 small issues that customers are bringing every day, for example, they spend time, like being

59:50 innovative, being even better at what you're really doing. And that makes a lot of sense. I think

59:57 post hog is a very big company. And that's not for no reason that they're

1:00:00 pivoting towards this new messaging of being the hub where you cannot make your business basically.

1:00:08 Yeah, I think it just speaks to the fact that there's going to be a lot of opportunities. And

1:00:14 you can solve problems for people in a more efficient way in a more effective way, too.

1:00:21 I think I talk a lot about this, like I, it's fine that AI can provide some efficiency.

1:00:27 The things that always get me excited are how do I get more effective? How do I do this better?

1:00:32 Because there's a limiting rate to how efficient you can be, but how effective you can be is almost

1:00:41 unlimited. So I think anything that we can do to say, let's just do this thing better. And I think

1:00:47 that's where SaaS companies, service companies, anyone can start, yes, leveraging AI, building

1:00:53 local models that can do the job better and more efficiently. I think there's going to be so much

1:01:00 opportunity for that. So there's a lot of doomers out there right now. I'm not one of them. I know

1:01:08 there's going to be some pain, like you don't go through a major transition without some societal

1:01:13 pain. But when we get through to the other side, I think it's just better. So I'm excited for it and

1:01:19 having a ton of fun with it right now. And I really appreciate what you guys are doing. I think

1:01:25 Reddit is a unique universe full of authenticity that is lacking in so many other platforms and so

1:01:35 many other venues and forums that people are going into to where it's like the last

1:01:41 bit of humanity out in the social network right now. So I think what you're doing to help people

1:01:48 and brands connect with the right people and connect in the right way is massively valuable.

1:01:56 So I really appreciate everything you're doing. And I really appreciate everything you shared

1:02:00 on the podcast today. Thank you. It was a pleasure. Maybe as a closing note,

1:02:06 if there's anyone in the audience interested in Reddit, our teams are likely going to work

1:02:12 together. We're exploring right now the service aspects because we know Reddit can be overwhelming

1:02:16 for people and that also intersects with what you were saying like SaaS are evolving towards service.

1:02:22 And your your co-founder also looked very interested in like spending more time

1:02:29 on Reddit and leveraging that as a distribution channel. Just go on LinScale website and or

1:02:37 Clearbox website and we'll be cool. It's free. We're cool guys. Worst case scenario will give

1:02:42 you a lot of value and best case scenario Reddit might become one of your best channel ever.

1:02:49 And I always like to say just one more thing. Right now I chase down every user that signs up

1:02:56 because I have access to the keys. So if you do sign up, you will likely get a message for me

1:03:02 saying, hey, thanks for signing up. And I'm here to help jump on a call with you share. And

1:03:07 my whole thing is I want you to win with the tool. So yeah, I'll close off there.

1:03:15 That's fantastic. I love it. Well, it's hyper relevant for us at LinScale for our own

1:03:20 business and growth. I know it's going to be unbelievably relevant for the companies that we

1:03:24 work with. And I appreciate everything you're doing, everything you shared and can't wait

1:03:29 to see what you guys do next. Thank you. Thank you, Anthony, so much for for setting this up

1:03:36 and being on it. We're excited to work with you guys together and help you guys win just as much.